Part 2 of our Discussion with Nexmune

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Welcome to the Pet Grooming Business podcast with me, Bill Betts where we give practical business advice to help you grow your pet grooming business. This podcast is sponsored by Low Pay, the low rate payment app that gives you more. So without further ado, let's get going.

Welcome everyone. Welcome to our next installment in the next meme brand. I am joined by John. Welcome, John. Hi Bill. Great to be back. Yeah, nice to see you again. We just to give you a heads up, we are suffering a little bit with slow Internet speed. I don't know if it's something to do with Spain, that's what I'm going to blame it on or yeah, the weather, I'm not sure. But just, just give us a, like, just give us a moment while we, what I'll do is I'll let you, you sort of talk and I try not to over talk here if the Internet sort of breaks out a bit.

So yeah, nice to see you. Nice to catch up with you today, John. So we are going to be looking at the. Some particular products that next immune produce and can that we can purchase from nexmune to, to use with our customers. But for those that haven't quite caught up with the nexmune podcast that we did a couple of weeks ago, um, perhaps you just give us a very, very brief overview of who you are and also a bit of an overview of the company as well.

Yeah, no, absolutely, yeah. So my name's John. As I say I am a veteran, so veteran background in practice, set up and ran a dermatology clinic for a number of years and, and kind of from that I've got into the, the, the education of getting other vet nurses to be involved with dermatology which is like quite just the management of, of skin problems, skin and ear problems with, with dogs and cats. But obviously for you guys it's going to be mainly dogs that we're talking about and then nextmune.

I came to work with them because, well, they wanted me to be involved with them like I say, educating vet nurses and over time it just became easier to work for them really. So yeah, I'm now the head of marketing here and education here at nexmune and we take a very educational approach. We're a dermatology company that do lots of skin and ear products as well as allergy testing and immunotherapy which is a vaccine that you develop if they're allergic to something to desensitize them to it.

So we've, we've kind of Got the holistic, you know, the kind of whole picture approach to managing skin and ear problems. And so, yeah, that's how we've sort of come to work with you, Bill, and with. Yeah, with you guys as groomers because actually, funny enough, you're seeing a lot of skin and coats and that thing. That's it. And my wife obviously is the. Is the pet groomer herself and has run her business for over 20 years now and has worked with Nexmune, I think before you were Next Moon, you're another company and has worked with nextmune afterwards as well.

And we stock your products, we use your products. We've got your products in our house for whenever. We've got the, the spray that you use. I can't remember what it's called. Contigo. We got, we got three bottles that in our house ready for when the children fall over or the dog cuts themselves or anything like that. Everything gets a spray of Contigo. So you're. Well, you're. You're definitely embedded in our house and within our business as well. So we thought it'd be great to introduce Nexmune to the wider pet grooming community.

Yeah, absolutely. I use Contigo on my son's. He's got a spinner in his finger and it's got a bit of infection on the end and I was using Contigo on that just the other day. So it's the same in my household. Bill? Yeah. Emma came home with a quite a nasty cat bite, actually. And she's like, no, we're not going to hospital. We're not. We don't need that. We're just going to treat it, I think like every other hour with Contigo. And she just, she religiously sprayed it for like a few days with Contigo.

All healed up, no issues whatsoever, no infection.

Yeah. I mean, that's amazing, Bill. And you know, it's a great testament to that. I'm sure we'll probably talk about the Tigo at some point. It's a really safe. It's got hypochlorous acid, really good anti. Antimicrobial effects. But yet you can use in wounds. But yeah, I mean, that's such a great example of how. I mean if, if ever we got bitten in practice. And I was many times, particularly by cats. Cats. Bacteria is almost like their venom. It's kind of. They're deliberately how to give you a nasty infection when they bite you.

So it was almost pretty standard. You have to go to the doctors get a course of antibiotics. So the fact that she's able to avoid it. There you go, that's. That is antibiotic avoidance in action, isn't it? Saving the planet? Yeah, it's quite like one of yours, I suppose. It's kind of, in a way, one of your sort of goals in a way is to reduce the amount of antibiotics used within animals because of the, the, the antibiotic resistance. Yeah, absolutely. And that's a real angle that we take in, in our education because, yeah, I'm really happy to say that that's something that we are very much behind and able to facilitate because, yeah, generally in the past the approach was when you had skin and ear problems, generally when you get problems with, with the skin, with the ears, you get a bacterial overload.

It's kind of like treated like an infection. So in the past it used to be antibiotics were chucked willy nilly. There's slowly been a change in mindset to that. But particularly recently in the vet industry, there are a real move to try and avoid using antibiotics as much as you possibly can, which kind of twofold really. It means first of all, Chinese topical products, because the skin is, you know, the bacteria that are on the surface of the skin. So topical products actually make a lot more sense than systemic antibiotics, you know, taking something orally or an injection.

So yeah, absolutely. Our products really feed into that also in, in kind of figuring out what it is that's on there. So like doing cytology, which is what, you know, vets will do to figure out what it is they're dealing with and then selecting the product and then dealing with the underlying cause, which I mentioned about the allergy testing and the immunotherapy. But because this is nearly always related to some sort of allergic reaction and in which case if you could deal with that, then you'll prevent the problems from coming back.

So yeah, we really lean into that and there's a lot more thought about that. Yeah, we've got dachshunds ourselves and one of our groomers, Morgan, she's got one of our baby dachshunds. Not so baby anymore, but one of our puppies. And know dachshunds ride quite low. They're quite. Their bellies can sometimes rub near the ground. Yeah, and he developed quite a red chest and obviously he's like balding and stuff like that. But this obviously seems to be a real sort of reaction to grass, which isn't a great time of year for him, obviously being out and about.

But again, using some of using Some of the nexmium products in the shampoos and stuff, getting him into the bath and reactions regularly using the next immune shampoos, which we'll. Sure, we'll go on and talk about gone, you know. Yeah, it's treating it, it's, it's working, it's getting, it's resolving the rash. You know, he's probably got an allergy that comes out in the summer and stuff, but we know how we can control it and keep it, keep it at bay. Yeah, I mean, that's, that's, you know, I'd see a lot of many different types of manifestations of allergy, but definitely this is similar to us, really.

Some, some dogs will suffer from more of a kind of what I would call a contact allergy, which is, is almost like a physical irritation by the plant. Plant spores rubbing up against and being left on the coat and that causing irritations. You know, I'd see, I do cytology, so. Which is effectively like a tape strip dabbed on the feet of some dogs that would go out walking and you could see all of these plant spores, just the huge burden of it. And actually, you know, that alone, different dogs will react differently to that.

So it is an allergy of sorts, but it's a little bit more perhaps the sort of allergy that we would know from eating something and then having an irritation from it. It's more of a direct contact allergy than say a systemic thing where, you know, you're being exposed to an allergy and then you're getting a general reaction. So, yeah, I mean, topical therapy works for them all. Topical therapy is just like I say, the, the, the use of stuff on the skin. So like you say shampoos, wipes, that sort of thing.

So, yeah, just a wash after, after that, you're never going to be able to stop that grass because they're so, like you say, they rise so low from whipping along the skin and it just, you know what it's like when you go out walking and you've been. Maybe you're sort of walking through the bushes and the trees and your skin kind of gets a bit irritated and then you wash the skin and then it's fine. And it's no different for them, really. Yeah. So if you're listening to this for the first time, it's the first time you've heard us talk about nexmune and their products and you're concerned as a groomer about that crossover between diagnosis and the vet, veterinary role and the groomers role within Looking after pets.

Please go back and listen to our podcast that we recorded a few weeks ago. We dive into that issue quite deeply. You know, John's worked within the veterinary industry as a vet nurse in practice, knows the rules, understands the boundaries and is also obviously working externally with it within Neximmune Can. And we had a really good talk about, you know, how as groomers we can use these products and approach our customers and, you know, hopefully help them. So please go back and listen to that, to that podcast to sort of clear that, that those nickels up in your mind.

This podcast is sponsored by Low Pay. Low Pay is half the price of sum up and Zettle, so you keep more of the money that you earn. Rate start at 0.79%. So I feel what we do today, John, is have a look at the sort of top products that you would recommend groomers look at. And I've broken it down into skin, which is probably quite a big area, ears and teeth, because they're like the main focus, the sort of people, the sort of issues that we see quite a lot.

And we have invited you over to our dog grooming salon so that you can come and see what it's like a day in a day in the life of a pet groomer. And I promise I'm going to show you our camera roll of horrors, which is basically our.

The mobile phone we have at the shop where we document everything that we find on these dogs. And I promise you, you will not want to eat your lunch whilst looking at these photos of the stuff that we find is horrific, absolutely horrific. But you know, we have to document these things to protect ourselves and also to show the owners when we, when we see the dogs, because let's face it, quite often the owners miss stuff. They're not switched on to it. They obviously they're stroking the dog or brushing the dog with a spoon and.

And they're not coming across the issues that we're seeing when we're diving into their coats. So first of all, let's look at the products that you would sort of recommend groomers look at when we are dealing with skin complaints. So like the yeasty skin, the dry skin, maybe the irritated skin, what products the nexmune offer to help with that.

Yeah, so I mean, we have lots and lots of different options for different why I say presentations. So in other words, you know how it looks, but then also different kind of preferences because, you know, all owners are different as to what they can do. Now actually, you're going to as Groomers, I think you'll be, you'll. You'll be in a better position than many vets straight off the bat for knowing what, what the dog will tolerate, because you're likely doing it themselves yourselves in the groomers, grooming parlor to them.

We were talking on the last podcast about how we don't actually, as. As vets, you know, we don't do much shampooing of dogs. So I was giving these out all the time, not necessarily doing themselves. So it puts you in a really unique position.

But I mean, effectively, I suppose, broad strokes, I would say. You've got shampoos. We've also got sprays and foams and wipes. I think that would be the main. There are some topical gels that have as well, but they're the, the main things. Now most of our products have something in called chlorhexidine or in some way made up by something called chlorhexidine, which I'm sure that you may have heard of. It's a really good, really strong antimicrobial. It's got a good residual action. So what happens with these skin and coats?

Yeah, like, like with your dog. Irritation then leads to a microbial overgrowth. So effectively there's bacteria on everyone's skin and every dog skin. But it's, it's like a normal level of natural bacteria, a bit like you would describe in the gut really. And then what happens? The skin gets irritated. That gets completely out of sync. They call it a dysbiosis and they start having the wrong levels of bacteria on their skin. And that in of itself is actually, is more itchy, more irritant than often what maybe causes the problem and the unsettling, be it a, a whipping, contact allergy like you were finding, or more of an allergy to, to something in the environment, airborne, which then causes them to itch.

So yeah, that's getting that, that bacterial overgrowth or, or dysbiosis as I call it, getting that under control with the topical products is, is the first and foremost. And yeah, those, those are really good options for that. Shampoo, spray, foam would be. Yeah, the main ones that I would highlight.

Now we have a number of different shampoos, different presentations, so it depends how you want to tackle that. Bill, really, we could talk in turn about each of those or did you have any specific conditions or something that you'd like? I think, you know, if we, if we think about the grooming salon, we get a lot of dogs that are coming in with like yeasty yeasty skin, Dry skin. Yeah. So maybe like, I suppose, is there a shampoo that would treat the yeasty sort of infection in the skin?

Yeah, yeah, no, it's a good question. It's a great question. I mean, so I'm talking about teary overload there, but you're absolutely right to point out that sometimes it can be a yeast overload. So now in a vet practice, what I would have done in my clinic was I would have done some tests and big strips, ascertain what it is that's on the surface of the skin and then select my shampoo or whatever I'm going to give them. According to that. You obviously don't have the facility to do that.

But what you'll see presented before you is a dog that skin is irritated, lightly red because of that, that upset in the microflora on their skin. Skin is red, they're itchy, they're irritated. And a normal shampoo at that point probably isn't going to help. If it's a good moisturizing, soothing shampoo, it may go some way, but you need to bring that under control.

My recommendation would be probably we've got chlorhexiderm 4% shampoo that comes as a shampoo, a spray and a foam that's very good at bringing bacteria under control because it's got the chlorhexidine that I mentioned and at 4% in, so it's, it's a good strength. But this is still a, an over counter shampoo that you can put up. It's not something that only vet can put up and it's, you know, something that they can get online. So. Yeah, and that would also have activity against yeast as well.

We do have another shampoo called Pepto Vet. It does more or less the same thing with a slightly different action, maybe slightly gentler. But, but yeah, those are the, those are the ones. And the benefit of having a shampoo, a spray and a foam is with the Chlorexid 4% one I mentioned, it's been shown in a study that actually shampooing twice a week and then applying the foam twice a day was as effective against this dysbiosis as a course of antibiotics. So you can give them something there in practice.

A bit like describing earlier with, yeah, with your wife's cat bite, that will prevent them from needing to go to the vet and get antibiotics. And obviously you guys, that's enormously helpful. So yeah, that would be, that would be a good one, good one to start with for those sorts of things. Excellent. And then another shampoo that we stock in our shop, and forgive me if I don't pronounce this right, is.

I can't even say it. Ermadira. Oh, yes. Amidra. A Mitra. Yeah, yeah, go on.

No, it's fine, Bill. I'll get off the hook. Because actually our products come from. They come from Italy and before. Yeah. When we were. I mean, I've been with the company for a while now and we're still quite a small company, to be honest with you. There's only. There's only about 30 of us, so that's why we got that personal touch. But we came from being even smaller than that. And originally it started from bringing these very, very good products that weren't available here to the uk.

And that's kind of how. How it started and grew from there. That's where the kind of a Midra name comes from. You know, it's. It's a bit an Italian name. Yeah. So I mentioned before that sometimes a just a really good, hydrating, soothing shampoo might be enough without necessarily the need for that antimicrobial action of the. Of the chlorhexidine. And that's where a Midra would come in. A Midra is just a really good moisturizing, soothing shampoo.

Yeah. So I suppose a little bit like the shampoos that you might be using in your grooming salons. Anyway, it's kind of like a. A general shampoo, but it really is a. A big level up from that along. Along the lines of you might see oatmeal shampoos, you know, kind of soothing, moisturizing dogs with allergies. And generally speaking, when it's thin skin like this, as I've mentioned before, and I'm sure will again, it's nearly always an underlying allergy to something.

Dogs with allergy. Allergy is twofold. It's both something systemic within them that's reacting so quite literally in the blood. They're reacting as we do really, to being allergic to something and that's manifesting itself on the skin. But it's also because of the nature of the fact that they react on the skin and because of the fact that it actually is in contact with their skin. So talks skin barrier, which is effectively how you protect the skin from those things that it's being exposed to. And so Amir does really well is builds up that skin barrier function by almost a bit like bricks and mortar.

If you imagine you've got a wall and you see one of those walls that's called the mortar failing and it's just unstable and it's much easier for things to get in of Midra kind of repointing that wall. You know, it's, it's filling in those, those gaps and then you. So as a result they get a much, much stronger skin barrier function. So again, that comes as a truce. And I'd often say to owners, the spray doesn't need to be kept in the fridge, but keep it in the fridge because it stays like this.

Now really lovely hot day is when dogs will start getting irritated and scratching when they're, when the heat just exacerbates it. And then so you get the spray out the fridge and it's lovely and soothing and you know, you could just use that in those, in those areas just to, just to cool their skin down really and so calm them down. So yeah, that would be my kind of synopsis of Madra Cool. And just, just to make it clear that we obviously as a groomers we stock these products to use within the grooming salon.

But then we also stock them to allow the, the owner to buy them at the end of the groom and to take them home and show them how to use them and suggest like you just down like how and when, when they should be used. So they're not just for us to use. These are products that with a Trade account with NextMune we can purchase at trade prices so that we can then also upsell to our customers as well if it helps the problem that you're presented with.

So let's also have a look at the CLX wipes as well. One of the biggest selling products that you have. Yeah, absolutely. It is as you say, one of our biggest sellers. And you've done a, a few pet shows. It's not generally main events is. Is who we work with, but when we do, often people heard of ex wives. So if you have those in your grooming salon and as you mentioned, you guys are able to buy those at a wholesale price which is competitive. We're giving you a particularly competitive wholesale price because we understand how competitive the market is.

So it means that you will, you'll be able to sell them at a price which is competitive to what they would find online. They'll probably recognize them already quite possibly especially as many of them will already be aware that their dog's got problems. And so then you know, repeat by them from you and when you come in. But I digress. So CLX wipes really good actually for what you described with, with your Dog because they're fantastic for their physical action of wiping the skin. Obviously, shampooing a dog every day is, is, Is hard.

I mean, you guys are the best in the business at it, and, and probably owners aren't going to be particularly keen to do it at home because that's why they're. They're paying you guys to do it. Right. But one thing you can do is if you're shampooing, let's say you select something like Chlorhexadem 4%, for example, because the skin's a bit red. Maybe you. You do the groom and shampoo with your normal shampoo and then you use the 4% as well because you can see there's some redness.

And then send them home with that. CLX wipes as well is a thing for them to buy, then to go home with that they can just use every day. So for your dog, for example, Bill, that would be wonderful to just. When you get home, the skin with that CLX wipe and a little bit like a wet wipe, it's physically cleaning the skin off, but it also has in it some climbisol, which is fungal, and chlorhexidine, again, which is what's in the 4% shampoo I mentioned. So it also has the antibacterial and antifungal action, which then means that residual effect is left on there to prevent the issues from coming back.

So many kind of. And all dogs react to their allergies and have levels of allergies in a different way. Some are hugely allergic and need lots of treatment. But there are some that can be managed just with CLX wipes or with a shampoo and a CLX wipes. And I think that's why they're such a big seller, because they really do work. Yeah. And we're thinking like Shar Peis with all the, with their folds or. And boxes with all, like the face folds and everything like that, where, you know, owners don't open up their face folds to clean them, let's face it.

And they get all crusty and creamy and horrible. So again, an upsell of a CLX wipe, demonstrating to the owner how to get into those folds, getting in there every sort of every day or every so often with a. With a wipe to try and prevent and to help help the face feel a lot better, I should think. Yeah, that's a real. Yeah, really good example. Absolutely. I mean, they're, they're hugely versatile. They can be used over the whole coat. I had owners who would use a CLX wipe to basically give them a full bath.

You know they'd use it over the whole coat because it was easier to do that than bathing them. But yeah, around the face which is difficult to shampoo at the best of times and leave something on brilliant for there. And accuracy because you're around the eye and then also like you say, getting in the folds. I mean even some of those folds I'd have owners who would. The CLX wipes they've got, you know, when you squeeze them you get a lot of moisture out. You know that.

And that is the, the antifungal, the chlorxidine and the moisturizers that it has in it even have people sort of squeeze them out onto a cotton bud and then run the cotton buds through the folds as well. Because these folds just, they, they are like. Yeah, their own. A little microclimate in there. And so they're going to need daily management even in a non allergic dog most likely. So yeah, you can, they're really great for those. And if you've got dogs with ear problems, more ear cleaners in a bit.

But CLXY is really good around the entrance to the ear as well because naturally, you know, this problem kind of comes out, gravitates out. So using them called the pinner and you know, kind of on the entrance to the ear as well. Yeah, really handy. Excellent. And we've got a quick question coming in whilst we're talking about skin. See that on, on your screen at all?

I'll read it out for the listeners. So Philippa has a Shih Tzu which has got really bad skin. Don't know if it's her own dog or a customer's dog but she has greasy fur and skin, lots of dandruff which is yellow in color and horrible smell which I probably thinking yeasty. She chews herself, scratches, but not all the time. She's on medication tablets from the vets and also cytopoint which is a medication they give to switch off the itch, I believe.

Correct. Yeah. Is there a product that you would sort of recommend is a customer's dog. So yeah, next time that that dog comes in, would there be a product that you'd recommend? Philippa discussed with her customer and maybe getting ready to, to try it and maybe this dog would be a very good case study for Philippa to how the next immune products work and follow the journey of the dogs and hopefully see the healing process. Yeah, it's a really great question Philippa and thank you because actually it's like you say, it's a fantastic example of just how much you guys can help because clearly the owner is obviously a bit of a treatment they feel doesn't really work.

Now what you guys aren't going to do, obviously you're not a second opinion to the vet. So an owner tell this and you're naturally going to be cautious thinking, well, I'm going to tell them something which is going to fix this dog because the vet will be continuing to work this up. They'll go back to the vet and they'll have more treatment. But there are absolutely things that you can recommend which trust me, say I worked in the veterinary industry. The vets will miss the opportunity to try and do so, you know, you can totally fit into that.

That.

So for this particular one, Philippa would. My recommendation would be Zinger Seb, which is actually my favorite shampoo of our range. I use a lot. So Zinger Seb is wonderful stuff. Again, like all of our products got chlorexane in. It's got a bit of zinc in it as well a name and, and it's got. It's very good at stripping out the. That kind of excess. I think you've been for it stripping out the excess scale is what we call it, which is what you're describing there. So scale is slightly different.

You dandruffy flakes, but yellow nature that you're describing sounds more like scale. This is all to do with happiness of the skin. I know I described a wall earlier, but it's like from bottom to top of that wall of the dog's skin should take around about three weeks for it to get from the bottom to the top. And we call that a skin turnover. And it's kind of constantly going up, as I'm sure you're aware. Once you get. Skin cells are dead. But what happens is when you've got a dog with upset skin, that can happen much quicker.

As quick as three days in fact. And then that. That what you then start getting is these flakes because then you know they're not ready. It's not the wall not layering itself up properly in order to protect leaves skin exposed to it being irritated to our irritations coming in and bacterial issues. Also it creates this, like you say, this horrible yellow scale. So what zinc is really good is. Is normalizing that, slowing that skin turnover down. It's particularly good if you've got a yellow Westie. It will make it white again.

That's what I liked about Zinka Seb. It would Give me as a, as a vet in a clinic I knew that one wash was Inca Seb and they'd be looking a lot better, a lot like they should be. And so it would, it would really help with getting that owner on board that I'm doing something that can help.

So yeah, definitely that one. It sounds to me like, I mean there could be a number of reasons why that presenting like that. The non response to size of point is interesting and you know we could go into that but I think that would be better.

But certainly I think that dog with the way it's presenting it needs a shampoo and it needs a good shampoo. Vet's recommended something then they're really missing a trick. You know giving that dog systemic treatment and not trying a topical treatment same time.

So that is one where genuinely I'm not saying it will happen but you could give it Zinka Sebastian it, you know it could nigh on fix the terminally they could such a better response from that and then they go back to the vet and say look, you know I've tried this zinger Seb and the vet would probably be familiar with. They'll certainly be familiar with us. And so they're only going to be impressed they've done that, not disappointed. What you know with with this stuff. And, and actually I think we need to point out that on your website there is product information and guidance.

Would you be looking at, you know, you know look like a daily shampoo and Zinco said to start off or and then reduce it or what's the sort of question? Yeah, I generally would say to owners I have to be realistic about how much they can shampoo. So I would say you know, shampoo twice a week. Now obviously you guys are probably going to be doing shampoo there anyway and so yeah shampoo twice a week. But if you can try and do something dirty as well then that will really make a difference.

Now zinc tub is actually available as a spray as well. So you could, you could do a zinc shampoo and then get spray skin particularly you know the worst areas with the spray but you can mix and match the products as well. So if we let's say you wanted to give them a Midra spray or that's what you stocked in then that would, that would also be really helpful because it would just help build up that now like I say the layers of all or if it was chloexidone 4% spray that they had as well that that would work that are products you can mix and match Them depending you've got available.

It's not like it's, it's a one size fits all but sorry, it's not. Yeah, it's not like there isn't one, one option that fix the whole thing, but yeah, particularly with scaly, flaky dogs. Zinger Seb shampoo. Yeah. Would be my recommendation. I think one of the important bits I like about this is that you are going to sit down with your customer and this is amazing value that you're giving your customers as well. You're going to have, you know, you're going to go away and do some research and some knowledge and that could be from speaking to the local territory manager who you're, you're sort of networking with because they can provide you with this information, researching the product through the next viewing website and the fact sheets.

But the value that you're going to give your customers, you're actually going to sit down with them, you're going to listen to them, you're going to hear what the issues are and their problems, you're going to be able to recommend a product that potentially or hopefully is going to improve that. But you're giving them that care that maybe other professionals haven't got the time for and you can actually look at building a case study around this. And we've certainly done this with customers where, you know, we have offered to have the dogs back to, on a, on a, you know, week by week basis to make sure it gets a shampoo and make sure it is working so that we can become more confident in the products ourselves as well.

But also you're going to be sitting down with the customer and you're going to be talking to them and going, okay, in my head I'm chatting to them. They're really busy, they've got children, etc, you know, they've got busy lives. Like you said, is the shampoo going to be realistic or. Based on what I've been chatting to you about, I think maybe this spray is a, is a better option for you. And then you come back every other week or every week for a bath as well.

And it's working. It's that working relationship with them, isn't is absolutely that. Yeah. And I mean that, that was, I really would say that that is what made my clinic successful more than anything else really is vets as you know, and not bashing them. It's really difficult. They get 10 or 15 minutes for a consult just like a GE does. And so, and this, it's so convoluted skin and so lifelong that quite often they reach for something which you know is going to fix the problem first time or they just reach for the same, same products that they know has worked for but it isn't really like that.

So don't have that time like you say to chat to them. And so I would have an hour long consult with them. Honestly, I think that's half the battle really because you could chat to them about it, listen to them and then there's so much more on board and welcome for your help because it's just frustrating, honestly, when you've got a dog that's just sat there in the living room while you're watching telly, just scratching away, you know, it drives you mad.

Agree, couldn't agree more. And I mean the foams as well, they're, you know, you sort of almost describe them to them like dry shampoos because people get on board with the idea of that effectively you're just, you're leaving a level of moisture and product on the skin to, to have its residual action, you know, to do its thing and to, and to moisturize the skin. But to them it feels like, oh, giving my dog a bath but without having go through the shampoo and they're rubbing the foam in.

So. Yeah, but like I say a lot, a lot of vets won't be thinking of doing like that. So it's enormously helpful for you guys to be aware of that possibility. So let's have a, let's move on from an extension of the skin from what you told me earlier and let's look at the.

So there's two products that we stock in our shop, stock and use. So we stock the osodine and the OTA act. And I believe they are complete, you know, they're, they're used for two different sort of usage. Exactly that. Yeah. So I mean, as you mentioned, Bill, the, the ear is an extension. It is skin, basically skin in a tunnel.

So you know, the, the skin goes into the ear and then goes down into the tunnel down to the ear bum. And if you've got a dog with allergies, their skin is irritated. But very often the area that's, that's affected is areas like you mentioned, skin builds like the armpits or axillas we call them in dogs and the groins. But mainly first and foremost is generally where it presents. So some dogs, people think, oh, they just, you know, they might be because they swim. But for the most part, if people think, oh my dog just cation problems, Chance.

I've just got a low level allergy and it just manifests only through the ears. The ear should be able to be fine and the ear has all sorts of bacteria and yeast and I've swabbed some healthy dog's ears and seen some really nasty stuff down there. Doesn't matter that dog, but it matters when they're irritated. So yeah, you're exactly right to say they have very different uses. So otoact I'll start with. To ACT is a really, really wonderful ear cleaner for just waxy ears. Wax buildup in years, which in of itself can be irritating as it is with us and it can cause a problem.

That doesn't necessarily mean they have an allergy, doesn't necessarily mean the ears are red. Just waxy, nasty ears. So if you've got a, a dog in and you're, you're grooming it and you're like, there's quite a lot of wax there. The ears are problem? No, the ears aren't a problem. Look, I recommend this product. It's got squalene in it and a bit of chamomile. Very gentle. All our ear clean is very bad. So they're not alcoholic, you know, they haven't got alcohol in. They're not what we would call a stringent really sort of nasty irritant ear cleaners.

But it's really good at lifting that wax out. So yeah, and it's really good for puppies as well actually if you've got, if you've got someone coming in with their puppy for breeding, which I'm guessing you guys do you have that, do you? To get the. Yeah, get used to it.

We run puppy packages. Yeah, definitely, yeah. Brilliant. Well that would be a great product to recommend and I would as well because particularly for breeds that are prone to having problems, which I'm sure you guys are all familiar with. But generally any breed that's got the, you know, the flappy pinners hanging down, I think they're younger when they're puppies. Getting them used to it is a really good idea. So we would do puppy clinics in practice, an O2 act to be a good ear cleaner to recommend because it's not that there is ear need cleaning, you're just getting them used to doing it.

So doing a couple of cleans with O2 act and it's pretty gentle. So that's O2 act. So Dean appreciates. It's got a bit of a similar name, but Otadine is. That's got chlorhexidine that's where the dean comes from. Clectidine, as I mentioned before in it, which is the antimicrobial. So this is now when you've got an ear that's got a bacterial overgrowth, it's got a problem down there. Red is effectively red. Itchy is where the chances are. The material down there might be perhaps a bit more runny, but kind of yellow greasy material down there.

That's when I would use otadine. Now that. To say that otadine is still a perfectly acceptable everyday ear cleaner. It's not like you're then giving them something that you think this is inappropriate because I'm not really sure if this has got a problem. Many people use otadine as a routine ear cleaner. It's just. It's particularly good if you've got those, you know, red sore ears. That's when I'd. Yeah. Recommend Odine. We have got another one I'll. I'll highlight for you as well called Chlorhexiderm. Oto Ear, which is available for you guys, that has got a bit of chlorhexidine in, but it's ever so fractionally.

It's just stick. Which it's still very, very gentle but very good for swimming dogs. So if you've got a. Which I'm sure you have, if you've got someone, I mean, their dogs are always going swimming in a local river or marsh or bog or whatever. And then of course, with a dog's ear can, it goes down and then in. And so what it's very. Is trapping water in it. It traps this like pond water in it and then they get a yeast overgrowth. And Florex to Dermoto is very good for cleaning the ear and dry it out so that you don't get that microbial overgrowth.

Or if you've just got dogs with flappy, really flappy pennies, you know, your sits or your daxies and you know those kinds of breeds, Cocker spaniels. Yeah, they get very sweaty, greasy ears because the ear is not getting to the air the same way it would do with a German shepherd or something. Again, Troto is really good for that. Okay, excellent. We've just had a. A question coming from Val. I'll put it on the screen.

Loving the spelling of these and pronouncations of East.

Irie plus IR or ir. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Val, I am sorry. We did. They weren't. They weren't a big seller for us and that's why it wasn't we couldn't justify it. Fortunately. We, you know, we have to buy at a certain level. So unless we can sell at a certain level, unfortunately we have had to discontinue some. It's a shame. I mean we really tried and we wouldn't rule it out. If there was a big demand once, you know, we're working with more of you guys because actually I think you groomers would you have more demand for this when we were talking to vets about it.

So yeah, I should. Sorry. First explain what it is. Yeah, yeah. So it's Erie plus is a effectively a saline based wipe. So wide bike clx wire. But there's nothing, there's nothing in it combat bacteria or anything like this. It's saline based but very good as a result for removing staining, tear staining down the eye. Hence erii I think that's where the name comes from. So obviously certain breeds particularly prone to that, you know, they've just always got that. So just clean with this Viru plus really helps lift that out.

So we would recommend it to vets, maybe have it on, you know, the count in waiting room or something because it's, it's not a, it's not a medical problem. So a vet isn't like they're not really interested a vet in aesthetic of the dog. They want to fix the dog's issues. So someone says I just got this staining here. You know, if anything they'd probably say, well those are the groomers. So in which case it would be. So we might do my recommendation in. In the meantime, Val would be.

And I don't know if you're on at the beginning of the webinar, but we were talking about ego. T goes a hypochlorous acid, a really safe gentle. I know it's got the word acid in it, but trust me, it is incredibly safe, gentle and dilute.

And so hypochlorous acid is safe in and around the eye, which is unlike anything. And so I would spray some hypochlorous acid, some cimtigo onto you know, like one of those dry pads that you'd use when doing your makeup and things and then use that in place of it. So that's our current recommendation. Instead of Vera plus. It'll probably go further as well actually as a result because it's. You've got the spray. So. Yeah. Thank you. There you go, Bill Contigo Eco Dermal spray. It does actually come as an ice spray which effectively a slightly lower parts per million if you're using as a wipe just down here.

It'd be fine to use the larger bottle. But yeah, might be. Might be one a good one to have the Contigo eye spray because it's, you know, it's easier thing for owners on this. I spray safe to use around the eye, spray onto a pad and then wipe that down. When you say about tear staining, obviously you can get muzzle staining around the muzzle. Pets are quite prone to stained feats as well. I think the Westies and. And stuff. Would you recommend the same sort of treatment for that?

Yeah, it's a really good question. Muzzle staining I'm guessing is going to be as a result of just the contact of the muzzle on there, wearing it regularly. And so the staining probably comes from the muzzle itself a bit. Maybe a bit of sweating. The tear stain was caused by a breed disposition to a tear duct not draining correctly down into the nasal cavity and down into the mouth. So an exit of tears effectively and then running down and causing the staining. The reason that IRID plus was great was because it was.

Because it was saline, it was just safe to use around the eye. There wasn't anything particularly about it that made it really good for removing that. It was just safe to use. Which is. Contigo is a good replacement. So around the muzzle. Yeah, absolutely. It would work for that to do the same thing. Or you could use CLX wipes because you're not quite so near the eye. They would be fine around there as well. For feet, I think we haven't really touched on feet yet. Feet is different.

If you've got a dog with stained feet, then that will be because of some kind of microbial imbalance a lot of dogs will get because again, as we mentioned, it's, you know, it's a crevice, it's a gap. It's an area where things build up. They very often get yeast, a yeast called malesthesia in between the toes. Again, that is just CLX wipes all over for that.

Sometimes that can and very, very often is a manifestation of an underlying allergy. A bit like I was saying with ears. But I'd see tons of cases that had feet problems. And the dog's got analogy, it only really manifests with its feet. They call it pododermatitis. Um, but it can be quite mild. Like you say, it's almost just staining. But I see a lot of cases where the feet are stained and the owners just think it's normal for, you know, for Monty to have stained feet and it's like, well, it kind of is normal frame, but it's not normal, actually.

Try some CLX wipes. Yes, exactly. You try some CLX wipes and then people are like, oh, wow. Actually, yeah, yeah. And because, you know when you start looking, you realize he's licking them. Every night when he sits there, he's licking his feet because he's always done it. You just think that's, that's a normal thing for him to do, but something's bothering his feet. So I would recommend CLX wipes. Excellent. And as we touched on Contigo, can we just sort of have an overview of Contigo when it comes to wound management?

Yes. Yeah, absolutely. So Contigo is, as I mentioned, is hypochlorous acid. I could bore you with the science of it. It's really interesting. We did a, we do a podcast as well and we had the, we had the chap on. But I won't, I just find it really fascinating. It's. And it's stronger than bleach, is the bottom line. Hypochlorous acid, but it's so much stronger. You can use it in very dilute ounce. So as a result, it's unlike bleach. I mean, it's, you know, bleach is literally thousands of times more, is less dilute in terms of its strength.

So unlike bleach is completely safe to use everywhere. But it's actually the strongest antimicrobial known to man.

So it's. And that's all that is in Contigo. You know, we can't formulate it or we upset the balance of it. So it's not like one of the shampoos where you put a bit of chlorhexidine and then you put a bit of a moisturizer and you, you put water in there and all this sort of thing. It is just hypochlorous acid in, in, in. You go to very low concentrations, but as a result, it's completely non toxic. And if you've got a wound, so, and I think this is a really good thing for owners to have because with wound management, if your dog gets a wound, if you're out and about and you get a cut, time is so of the essence.

The sooner you can get that wound clean, the better. And they say really within the first half an hour. So having something in your back of your car you can immediately spray. It's also with wounds, it's. Lavage is the answer. So you want to, you want to wash that Wound out as much as possible and. But the only things you can use to do that are things which aren't going to slow that wound healing afterwards. So water, saline, even better than water or Contigo. But Contigo is actually antifungal, anti, antibacterial.

So as a result it's. Yeah, it's far superior. So, yeah, very popular with wound management. Now I would say to your owners, just keep one in the back of your car. You know, when you go for a walk and then they've come through the bushes and they come back and they've got a big slice on the face or on the foot or what have you, you know. Oh, man, you know, I need to take them to the vets or maybe I need to take them to the vets.

But you might not need to. Right. A lot of wounds, they just heal up naturally. They're quite tough and resilient, aren't they, dogs? Unless it gets infected. But if you can get back to the car, spray it with Contigo and then do exactly like your, your wife is doing and spray with the Contigo as much as you like really a few times a day, then, then you potentially could. Could get it. Yeah, could prevent that from ever need to go to. To the vets. Because it has Contigo, unlike chlorhexidine I mentioned before, which keeps working.

When you put it on the skin, it keeps working. That's why it's so good. Contigo works for about 0.2 seconds and then it's done and it's just breaks down into saline and water, which is why it's so safe. But it means that it has. No, once you've sprayed it, it's done a thing. So regular spraying is. Is the key with Contigo and things like. Obviously I know groomers are working with sharp influence clippers, scissors and live animals that, that don't behave how they always want to. Would you use Contigo on clipper rashes, cuts with scissors?

Obviously we use it on our set rolls quite a lot and bites and scratches. We use it on our kids, everything else. But in the practical application within the salon. Have a bottle for yourself within the salon and you, you'd use that on the rashes and the cuts and the, the accidents that we have. Yeah, that's such a good point, Bill. Yeah, absolutely. And in fact, the vets that are, I mean vets are really taken to catego because it's got such a wide spectrum of use. It's insane.

You can use It. Because it's so safe with all sorts of different things. But yeah, they. If a lot of vets have got it in practice now because they have the same thing, you know, when you're clipping the front of the pore to get the cephalic vein, you know, to get the. When they're going for a blood sample, you'll get clipper rash. You get clipper clipping them for. For operations. Because I can say, this is a vet nurse. We are not groomers. We're terrible. And I'm sure you probably.

I was going to say this. There won't be groomers listening, going, no, we don't get clipper rash at the. Front of rash professionals actually. Maybe, yeah, come and. Come and learn from us. But. But yeah, there are. There are places, you know, when they're doing the. What we call the 10 sort of the hygiene trimming and stuff like that. Sometimes there can be clipper rashes around there. Well, and Nick's like, you say it's a moving. It's a moving object, isn't it? Moving target. So. Yeah, moving target.

So accidents happen and when they do. Absolutely. You can give them Contigo, maybe send them home with a ball and then they won't, you know, won't be upset. Yes. And I think. I believe I've seen it. There's definitely a bottle of Contigo cat in our house. So is there a different strength for cats and dogs or the cat one? I'm trying to think what that. Yeah, so it's. It. It's sort of one size doesn't. No, that's the old bottle. It does everything, really. So it's one bottle for horses, cats, dogs and actually lots of other things besides.

I don't know how much you use.

Yeah. How much you use it for. For how much you groom other species. But it's really good for things like rabbits, guinea pigs, like even reptiles, because you can't use anything on them because their skin is so sensitive. But Katigo is so safe.

Yeah. I can see Philippa here saying about the fact it does happen. Cliff Arash. Yeah, we've all been there and it's always a bit embarrassing, isn't it, when you've done it and it's after that. Oh, no, I'm so sorry. He's got the owners forgive him, but yeah. So it wouldn't have been a cat one. But we do have it, as I mentioned, we have it as an ear wash, as a mouthwash and as an eye spray.

And I mean, there is Very little difference. They are just hypochlorosine in a different bottle. The different applicator, there are slightly different parts per million. Very. They're all very, very dilute, but it's slightly different. So it means that the, the ARN is maybe just a little bit gentler for the eye and the ear one's fine to use in the end, so. But yeah, those are the different formulations and they're all available to you.

Excellent. Okay, so we've done skin pretty much. I mean, there are loads and loads of products for people to go and look at. We're just trying to pick out. I'm picking out the ones that we, as pet groomers, we stock in our own. In our own shop. We talk to our customers about and we use ourselves on our own pets and customs. Pets. So don't, don't think that this is like a very small range. There's a large range out there, but for, you know, an hour's podcast, we're just trying to keep it to what I feel might be useful for groomers.

So we've done, we've done skin, we've done ears, we've touched on wounds and we've touched on feet. We've covered loads here already. But the last but not least, and this is something that we again use within our salon is when we're doing the teeth cleaning and we send the Upsell Storidine to our. To our teeth cleaning customers. Now, I don't know if you. Do you. Have you heard of Orozyme? Have you heard of that before? I have, yeah. Yes. So I'll have to look up what's in it.

Yeah. I spoke to my wife the other day and there is a clear distinction between Orozyme and Stomidine. So this isn't one product for the other. This is a product to complement your teeth cleaning. So the Orozyme will. We will use that to help the owner clean the dog's teeth and break the plaque and tartar down. Whereas we'll use Stomidym. I'm sure you'll go into this a bit more detail to help the owners after the teeth clean, to help with the, the healing of the gums and, and preventing buildup.

Again, that's it. I think that, yeah, that, that, you know, that's. You've nailed it in a nutshell there, really, Bill. I think so. What's in clo. I could. Sorry, I probably wants to. Well, chlorhexine, our good friend chlorhexidine, because bacteria builds up Everywhere, including in the mouth, as you can imagine. I mean, tartar is effectively calcified plaque. Plaque is the problem, which, as you know from many, many toothpaste adverts, is a yellow film builds biofilm basically in the mouth and the biofilm is made by bacteria. And so if you can try and prevent that bacteria from building up, which is what we do a lot really, when we're brushing our teeth twice a day, it's just preventing that bacteria from building up.

So brushing, brushing pets teeth is tough and so what a lot of owners, you know, you get a bit of resistance with that. So as nurses, as vet nurses in practice, we always trying to work with owners to try and find something that they could do. Staunadine is a gel that you just have to get in the mouth. It's sort of like, it smells and tastes a little bit like kind of meaty porridge. It's not unpleasant if you try it, but they like it. Many animals, sorry, many pets will just lick it from, from your finger.

We've got these videos of no cap just licking Stomid and it'll do its job once it's in the mouth. It'll do its job. I mean, if you can. And it's better is they sort of actually, with your finger, just wipe it around the teeth. But yeah, it, the chloroxine gets rid of that bacterial buildup and it also has a bit of an anti inflammatory in it called something called phytofinidine, which when you get the red lines along the top of the teeth on the gums, that's obviously gingivitis or the beginning stages of gingivitis, which comes because of the plaque on the teeth.

So that just settles down that inflammation. And so like you say, it's very good after in vets, after dentistry has been done, but particularly good for once you've cleaned that tartar off. It's not an aesthetic thing. This is preventing mouth getting dental disease and plaque buildup, but then as a result down the line, tartar buildup as well. The other one I would just mention, of course, well, I mentioned it just earlier, is Contigo mouthwash as well, which again, Contigo, like I say, hypochlorous acid breaks down bacteria.

So that's another one. Where is a good option for spraying in the mouth in order to deal with bacteria and particularly if they've had dental extractions or something like that, it's really good as well. So I mean, brilliant, thank you for that. And I don't know Whether you know you're coming from a veterinary background, this is always interesting. Whether you've ever heard of me pet or cleany teeth.

Do you know, I, I'm, I feel like I'm a bit ignorant here. I mean we didn't, we had when, when I worked in Baptist. You don't what you do, as I'm sure you know. I'd always say veterinary dentistry is a bit like 1960s NHS dentistry in that you basically take the teeth out if there's a problem. There's, there are, there are some referral clinics that will do all sorts of clever things with the teeth. But because you have to anesthetize an animal in order to do anything with its teeth, I mean, you guys work miracles not doing that.

I think it's incredible. But because you have to anesthetize them, then really the best option genuinely is just to extract the teeth because they'll do fine with our. So as a result we didn't stock and sell many kind of just regular oral hygiene products. We would have something like stomiding. We'd maybe sell a food like Hills TD that would be particularly good for cleaning the teeth and, and we'd advocate teeth brushing. So we'd sell toothbrushes and pet toothpaste, like CT toothpaste, something like that. So no, I, yeah, I have to be honest, I haven't heard of those.

We, it's, we've been using it since lockdown, five years. It's something that groomers is hit and miss. Some groomers are supported by their local vets if they'd heard of it. Some groomers are demolished on the Internet for using it by. Well, vet nurses can be sometimes the worst. So, you know, it's always nice to, if you do meet your vet nurse pals and vet pals just to maybe have a look at me pet and cleaning teeth and look at the benefits of. And this is the stuff that we're using.

But don't get too enthusiastic about it, we'll keep it within the grooming industry, thank you very much. And we'll just do what we're doing.

Yeah, yeah, that's good. Just to keep you. Just to give the listeners a bit of an idea about these products. As we said that you can create a trade account account with nexmia. Now this is very, this is quite new to the pet grooming industry. Most pet groomers have to source their products direct from a company. Not very rarely are they given discounts or given any kind of like incentives to buy. Often we Find ourselves as a pet groomer buying from ebay and Amazon and places like that.

Well, we're lucky that my wife's a vet nurse and an sqp so we have access to the National Veterinary Service and we can buy bulk from, from suppliers and stuff and get free delivery. But having a trade account is quite a new, a new thing within industry. And as someone tells me differently. But just to give you an idea on prices that you're going to be having access to, the. The recent price list that I've been given by Nixmune and this includes bat. A tube of stomidine would cost you £6 95 as a business.

Now the suggested, there is no suggested markup and this is also confused a few pet groomers because again, we're not used to doing this kind of thing with markups and stuff, but we always sort of turn to Amazon and see what Amazon are selling it for. So the price to us as a business is 6 pound 95 including BAT and Amazon would be retailing it for 12 pounds 95. So we would kind of business sort of reflect the Amazon kind of price. Obviously they're there in front of us, they can buy it there and then and they can take it away.

And we've got the added value that we can show them how to use the product like the CLX wipe or the Honest Omidine and stuff like that. So, you know, this is a fantastic opportunity for the pet grooming industry to work with Nexmune to get these products into our businesses and start providing an extra layer of care, which I know pet groomers want to do and want to sort of help. Because as pet groomers I think they get quite burnt out, mentally burnt out. Seeing the dogs every six weeks with the same skin conditions, the same sort of scratches, itches, you know, all this sort of stuff.

And now having knowledge of these products and starting to use some of these products and I re urge people to get hold of them for their own pets as well and test them and take photos and follow that journey to prove to yourself that, you know, you can make an impact. I think it's a great opportunity to work with Nextrean and get this into our businesses. So I just wanted to point that out. And the other thing that we touched on before we went live was that working with the pet grooming industry is new to Nexmune as well.

So, you know, we're working through the teething problems, new business, you know, it's a new, it's a new part of Their business, it's a new people to work with. It's new to groomers, new to NextMune. So, you know, I think it's just give you a bit of slack and you'll work through any teething problems that you come across.

Yeah, no, thank you. That's very kind of you to say. And obviously, as a result, we will. To make it really easy, the end goal is to have a online shop that you can buy at once you've created an account with us, I suppose, like an online Costco. So you as groomers is an exclusive area that you can go and buy at the groomer price. I'll just make it really easy then for you to, you know, restock as you go. At the moment that's not quite ready.

So it is a case of, you know, emailing us and placing orders in that way. So that's why. Yeah, to just like, say, bear with us. But like, I think like you say, Bill, the important thing is, is what we're trying to do is make that you're able to buy the products and buy the products at a price that means that you can make a profit when selling them for, as you recommend, competitive price, which I think is really important. And I think also.

I just lost my train of thought then. Oh, yes, I was going to say Pet Groomer UK are leading the way. So obviously your. Your next is a multinational company and my wife introduced me to your territorial manager, who introduced me to yourself.

You know, you've embraced the pet grooming industry and I can thank you for that. But now your international partners are starting to take notice, aren't they? So the UK is leading the way of this. Yes, absolutely. Yeah, that's very true to say that we. It's not something that Neximmune, which is a global company now, we're very kind of.

We're very much a UK team here and so what we're doing is we're. You're not dealing. You are dealing with a global company, but you're very much. It won't feel like that. I feel like you're some guys in the UK and that is the case.

But as a result, yeah, the global company has been interested in it because actually, I think it has huge potential because I think it is amazing, the access and I'm very much looking forward, Bill, to seeing setup and the horrors in order to see what you guys are dealing with. And. And I think that's why, you know, as we said, like, as a vet nurse myself, so many nurses become groomers I think that there is, that just shows you know that that crossover that's there to understand.

It's not like, isn't just an aesthetic thing like these dogs, their hair needs trimming and in order for their, you know, for their welfare and well being and they so Often, you know, 25% of dogs have skin problems. It's a third of the cases that come into veterinary practice really common and you're seeing that you know, firsthand. So I do think it's yeah huge potential.

Just one more case study or case to pick your brains over. I'll put the oh yeah screen. It's quite a big one. So Georgina has been washing a client's pug twice a week and as soon as you say pug you can probably start thinking about the, the kind of issues that you're going to start getting presented with. Dog gets a black thumbprint sized patch on their skin and the skin slightly red and peeling on the edges of these patches. It's being shampooed. Maliceb. Let's love a bit of Maliceb.

One ear regularly becomes irritated with yeasty, sticky yellow colored substances. I'm not looking forward to my lunch now and has it been off at different times throughout the past year for the skin ear issues? At times we think it's the end of the skin issue but there's no but it's still sort of black patches. What, what would you send the, the owner home with?

Yeah, it's an interesting one. I mean it's hard to say those batches that are yeah slight slightly red peeling at the edge of those patches. I mean it sounds to me what can happen with skin over time when, when a, when a dog's lifelong allergy and they can, they have what we call flares or it comes again.

They can, you can get something called lichenification which is just like you get on a wall so you get these areas of pigmentation effectively and the skin becomes really patchy. A really good again a really good product for that would be Finger Seb because. Or it's just really good at normalizing that skin turnover. So the black patches. Well I would recommend Thinker Seb. Sounds to me like that dog has underlying allergy that is just recurrent. So when you feel like, you say you feel like you're coming to the end and it's getting better.

Well the problem is when you've got an allergy you're never coming to the end of it. And this what I spent my, my, you know my time doing the clinic was Telling. And this is going to be an iflocation. They're gonna have this forever. So that pug is going to need the treatment for these skin problems forever is, you know, it's not something that's going to stop and then come back in.

The other thing to mention, you talked about the ears and you, you described perfectly there. So, yeah, thanks for that. The, the material that I was describing that otadine is good for in the ears. So I would definitely recommend otadine air cleaner for that dog. Zinc for the skin.

Now, what I would do, would have done in my clinic, what I would have given them two bottles for the shower. You remember why? Two bottles into the shower. So I would have given them an antimicrobial shampoo, a strong antimicrobial shampoo, like 4% before and then zinc soap afterwards. So they clean with the antimicrobial, try and leave it on for about five minutes. And I'd say to the owners, you know, sometimes, I mean, hopefully it's you guys doing it right and not them, but don't sort of sit and look at the dog in the bath, take it out in the garden, love up in the shampoo, then come back and rinse it off the zinc.

So don't need to leave on. That's straight on and off. But it's kind of like the, the conditioner so much as. As it were. So that would be my recommendation. Otadine and then a chloroxoderm and zinca should do combo for that dog. But again, I would have the expectation that that's probably going to be the case for life and it still might need some other treatment and medication from the vet to manage the allergy. And I would just add my little ten pill is, you know, take photos whenever you see this done.

You know, take photos and document what you're seeing so that you can have this timeline in this case study to see whether what you're helping with is helping. Because we see so many pets and I know groomers have a fantastic memory when it comes to pets, but, you know, it's nice to have that video graphic, graphic evidence of what the changes are in that dog's coat and condition. So use your mobile phones and record that. Record the evidence. That's such good advice.

Excellent. Well, as usual, thank you so much for your time. I hope everyone's enjoyed listening to it. I hope the sound wasn't too bad, I think, but if need be, we can always re record it. If it comes out poorly on the podcast, I'll I'll put into the groups the contact details for the territorial managers. Don't think of these people as sales people. Don't think of them as sales like territorial sales managers or anything like that. Think of them as they're there to help you. My, my clients, many of them in the next few weeks have got a.

I've got lunch and learns booked in with these territory managers where they're going to be discussing what we've discussed on this podcast. They're going to be provided lunch. You know, you're the groomers now. We're being treated as like proper, proper businesses, if that makes sense. Yeah, yeah. Bringing us lunch to talk to us about their products and, and explain how it can help their custom.

Get in touch with your local territory manager. They're there to iron out any problems. If a product turns up damaged, that's the people to turn to and they'll get that replaced for you. If you've got a question about a product and whether it's suitability, again, they're the people that will be there to help you. They're more than happy to deliver training, they're happy to deliver leaflets, products even. I think sometimes they even provide sort of stands for your shop and, and all sorts of stuff like that.

So get involved, get amongst it, speak to them, don't be scared of them. I've got clients now that are, you know, they've got salons within sort of 10 mile radius of each other and they've all come together as a group and booked a session with, with the territorial manager. Yes, there is one in Ireland. I've got his details and I'll put it in the, in the group for you. So Northern Ireland, Ireland, England, Scotland. We've got it all covered. Usa. We're, we're on route at some point I'm sure.

Get involved. Brilliant. Yeah, absolutely I do, yeah, we're here to help. Excellent. Well, thank you for your time John and maybe we can get you back on the podcast within a couple of months with any updates and just, just an idea as to like how everything's going and any patterns that you noticed or any information that you need to deliver out to, to pet groomers. That'd be great. Yeah, absolutely would be my pleasure. Excellent. Thanks a lot. See you soon. Thanks Bill. See you soon. I hope you have enjoyed this podcast.

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